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01/22/2018 @ 11:54 AM
 

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 Calling sequence for yotes?

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Cactus Juice
 January 08 2018 04:41PM (Read 2406 times)  
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I'm just looking for some newbie info on calling sequences that work for you guys. I went and got myself a Foxpro Inferno this summer and I'm hoping to let the new .243 get a few down. I've watched a lot of videos and have read a lot of things on here as well. I know it's going to be trial and error most days, and I'm just hoping to learn from my mistakes.

I went out Sunday morning around 8 and tried 4 sets in 4 different properties and didn't see a thing. Fresh tracks and pee in the snow, and these are areas that I know have a couple dogs. I tried starting out with distress, then woodpecker, then mouse squeaks, getting softer. I tried doing the opposite and then getting louder. I ran the call almost nonstop. I sat for around 25 minutes each time.

The videos I watch seem to keep running the call nonstop, then other videos, they will say run 2 minutes, then stop for awhile...run couple more, then stop again. Some say mostly loud distress, while others say howl, then distress, then puppy. So many choices, but a lot of these are in different areas of the country as well.

I know everyone has their own thing that works for them. What I'm looking to get is some info from here in Iowa on what works best. Should I set the volume low to start, should I come in rabbit distress loud? Should I run it 15 minutes straight, should I run 2 minute off and on? Should I go out in the dark in the morning, or should I wait until an hour before sunset?

I think I'm learning the wind setup and call placement, etc. I just don't know anything about calling sequence, volume, or frequency of calling. If I could just start gathering your opinions on what works for you, I will have an idea on where to start this weekend.

Thanks.


Brian
 
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scruffy
 January 08 2018 09:57PM  
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what part of the state are you calling, or what terrain are you calling?

It all works, continuous calling, sporadic calling, first light, last light, day time, night time, etc. IMHO, the more important thing is have you created a safe feeling approach for the coyote. If a coyote doesn't feel safe exposing himself approaching a call, it more often than not will not approach. The coyote will make a note and check it out much later, maybe after dark, or circle hundreds of yards downwind, or both.

Making a coyote feel safe involves giving the coyote some cover to approach the caller. Crossing a picked bean field is pretty much zero cover. But a fence line, grassy drainage, calling crp, timber finger, etc are examples of giving coyotes safe feeling approaches with the terrain. The coyotes will most often approach on the downwind sides of these terrain features so setup able to see the downwind side. If you place the call in the edge of the cover the coyote will often circle out into the open to check for danger, whereas if you put the caller out in the open the coyote will more often stay in the cover as it approaches to view any dangers.

One of my favorite setups is a small rise in pasture or field with cover on two or three sides, and the coyote can't see the top of the center of the rise from the cover so has to leave the cover a little, maybe just 10-15 yards, trying to see what's on top the rise, and that exposes the coyote for a shot and the coyotes feels safe not getting more than that distance from cover.

Another way to make a coyote feel safe is to add confidence sounds. After using some distress and nothing has showed up add in some sounds the coyotes would normally hear that make them think the distress they heard is legit and safe to approach. Crows commonly are on a kill and loudly announce it's presence, so playing crow sounds will often give the appearance to the coyote things are safe. Mix in other predator sounds like owls or hawks. Mix in distress with the crow confidence sounds and other predator sounds like owls, paint a clear picture of what is going on so the coyote don't have any doubts what is going on down the creek or over the hill and feels safe to approach the scene. If one distress hasn't worked then change distress, sometimes that shakes a coyote loose. Adding confidence sounds between the sound switch, like squirrel barks in the timber, will also give the coyote confidence that something the coyote doesn't need to be afraid of is punishing the distressed animal and they should check it out when the second distress starts.

Non threatening howls also can make a coyote feel safe. A coyote wondering what is causing an animal to be in distress will have that question answered when it hears a nice sounding coyote sounding off from where it heard the distress come from. Coyotes that have a territory will have the core of that territory established normally in the middle of the section (terrain and cover can influence that obviously). There are a number of transient coyotes that don't have territories. In the early winter after dispersal the majority of coyotes are transient, but as the winter progresses and many are killed the remaining pair up, more and more have territories but there are always transients around. If the distress and howl come from areas shallow into the section, out of the sight of the road, in the transient area, the distress and friendly howl can call in both other transient coyotes in the section as well as any territorial coyotes from deeper into the section.

If you use aggressive howls shallow in the section the transient coyotes probably won't approach because they have nothing to protect and you're quite possibly not in the core of the territorial coyotes in that section so the likelihood they come for a fight is lower (not zero, but lower). Aggressive howling when done closer or in the core of a coyote's territory, especially in mating season coming up, will quite often provoke a response. The response might be they come for a fight, or it might be the coyotes go deep into their core and challenge you back and/or wait you out so see what you as an aggressive coyote do. Regardless, transient coyotes likely won't approach your aggressive vocalizations because those transients don't feel safe and they don't have anything to protect.

So bottom line, call however you want as far as the duration, the volume depends on the echoing and wind speed and hills and a number of other factors. The main thing is using the land features to give an approach that makes the coyote feel safe approaching so he's commit to approaching. Also use your sounds to make the coyote feel safe. Paint the picture of what's going on, answer the questions the coyote has running through his head on what is playing out. And if you are using vocalizations keep in mind where you are at in the section and if you are likely calling transients or the territory owners in the types of howls you select. Each howl has its place, and each when not used in that place gets poorer results than you probably want.

One last thought I had, sporadic calling, say calling for 15-30 seconds and then waiting 3-7 minutes in silence before repeating, will call fewer coyotes than continuous calling, in my experience anyway. But the coyotes that approach a sporadic sound come in relaxed, slower, can more easily be coaxed with lip squeeks if needed to come out from behind some brush, are easier to stop with a high pitched bark or voice howl for a shot, etc. So the coyotes that come to a sporadic calling sequence are often times much easier to manipulate and therefor kill. I think more coyotes will come to continuous calling (maybe double) but most of those are coming quicker, are excited, "jacked up", are harder if not impossible to coax, are often harder to stop, sometimes muting the caller stops them but if you need to call them closer or manipulate them past that it's often hard or impossible. They often double back for apparently no reason and leave as quick as they come. So while I believe that continuous calling calls more coyotes, those coyotes are often much harder to kill. Not all of them are harder, and things often come together, but as a general rule in my experience sporadic called coyotes are easier to kill.

and keep a journal. I've called coyotes for over 20 years but only kept a journal for over 10. I can go back over the last 10 years and see what moon phases at night have given me the best day time calling results. what barometric pressures have given me the best results. what series at different times of the year have worked well for me. What farms have produced at what times of day and what wind directions. Over time you can begin to hone your hunting for what works for you.

Good luck, hunt safe, and make the coyote think it's hunting safe as well. Mr. Green

later,
scruffy


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KeokukCoboy
 January 09 2018 09:26AM  
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SCRUFFY pretty much summed it up. Thats a good read right there. If I was to add anything it would be to remind you that the hunt starts when you park the vehicle. Getting in to set up requires stealth. Keep your movements while on the stand to a minimum. Never Ever give up hope, stay confident. Calling aint easy but it does get less difficult with time and experience.


On another note.I called last evening little before dark using a mix of howls and rodent distress. Just something I tossed together. No rhyme or reason to it. At last light I get coyotes to howl at me under a hundred yards out. Then another pack behind me a little farther off. All together I had four different packs going off at the same time with a couple of singles that were very close. Sort of makes your hair stand up on the back of your neck. No shots fired which is ok by me. Im just glad I was there to listen to it and experience that hunt.


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whiterook
 January 09 2018 10:25AM  
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A couple of pointers. I've stalked coyotes I've seen for many decades. Avoid walking into a section with the "wind in your face". As most ALL coyotes up ahead of you. Stand a very good chance of seeing you walk in from long range. The game is pretty much over by then, if that happens.

Secondly, walk/stalk in like a cat. Stealthy quiet...quiet...quiet. BTW, when I did walk into a section to make call stand. Most often I would make a stand no farther than a 1/4 mile in. Because during day times hrs. Most coyotes will reside near the center area of a square mile section.


 
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Cactus Juice
 January 10 2018 05:53PM  
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This is all some very helpful information, guys. Ev, looking back, I did approach with the wind in my face on the first 2 sets. The others were crosswind. I will keep that in mind.

I'm in NE Iowa, just outside of Masonville. Not very hilly terrain at all. My hunting areas that I tried are all my good deer hunting areas with long finger timbers running along creeks, but surrounded by fields. My first 2 sets were actually up in my tree stands. The first, I put the call out in the field, but along a grass bank creek about 30 yards from the timber edge. The stand is just inside the timber.

The second set, I placed the call on a log, just at the edge of the timber/crp.

The third set was just all wrong. But, the 4th I thought was pretty good. I put the call in a clump of grass out in the filed about 40 yards out. I tucked way back in some cedars. Still nothing.

We had a strong south wind last Sunday, so all my sets were facing into the wind, with the call behind me twice, and in front of me twice. I'm trying to picture the coyotes staying in the cover, but coming along the edge, so I can get a shot. I just didn't see anything, so I can't say that I made mistakes to learn from...yet.

It's funny how you talked about crows, Scruffy. The last set, I actually had 2 crows come into the call and keep hovering and landing looking for something. I might try to throw in some coyote calls after the distress and see what happens. I hope to get out this weekend, although it will be a bit colder. Maybe they will be hungrier. I just picked up some really good areas along coffin's creek, and some have some permanent ground blinds. I'm hoping these will be good for the wind. Landowner says there are a lot around.


Brian
 
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whiterook
 January 11 2018 08:35AM  
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Brian,

Both Red Fox & coyotes spend little time on the "up-wind" areas. They use them mainly as. Transition areas to get from one down-wind area to the next. Experienced spot/stalkers know this. Because both canines mainly reside or can be found on the wind-break areas/down-wind areas. As those places cut the wind to some extent. Both canines when traveling into a wind. Will angle/cut that wind. To reduce the wind from blowing in their face & into the cones of their ears. Like most domestic dogs. These wild canines do NOT like wind blowing into their face. Use any & all canine behaviors to your advantage. Beat them at their own game.

One more tidbit. In high winds of around 20 mph or so. Both canines when bedded down. Will be facing more in alignment to their immediate down-wind. I've seen this hundreds of time. They all do it.

As an example; Wind 20 mph from the NorWest. A bedded canine will most often be facing an Easterly direction. Such as, SouEast, East (dependent upon terrain structure & or ground cover). So in that scenario. I would avoid walking in from any of those directions.

The smarter a hunter is. The more dead wild canines there will be. Provided that hunter can shoot? Laughing Out Loud


 
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KeokukCoboy
 January 11 2018 08:44AM  
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Myself, I would stay out of the tree stands. When they come into the call most likely they will be cautious and it would be difficult to hide any movement. Windy days are a bummer for any caller. Anything over seven mph my luck goes down the tube. When that happens I will call in large timbers or pack up and head to the river to find low lying areas. This time of year, remember that its breeding season and vocals can really change your game. Female howls like shes looking for a partner with a couple of whimpers mixed in could be the ticket. Adult distress,pup distress at the end of your calling is always a good thing. I still use distress calls but I mix them up more than I did at the beginning of the season. You have some good times ahead of you,just stick with it. Your at a point where most folks would give up. If that happens, get past it. Stay confident. It took me twenty one sets to call in my first yote and that was on a hot summer day. Im very interested in this thread and what these guys have to say. They have both taught me damn near everything I know about this sport.


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gsgramps
 January 11 2018 11:32AM  


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scruffy----your advice on the crows is right on. when the weather gets really cold and the notes are looking for any type meal i carry 3 crow decoys with my attractor. i set them up close to my bunny. first i like to play the distress for a few minutes and then add the crow call with a hand call. only problem i have now is my crows have a stake and are hard to keep upright. but usually can find some kind of material or snow to prop them up. yotes love to run off crows for an easy meal. try it and let us know if it works for you.


 
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Mengo
 January 12 2018 04:17PM  
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Bump....I am also new to predator hunting and appreciate any and all info and advice on the subject; it's sure not as simple as taking a caller out and slay them. They are tough.
Bring on the advice and tips......can never learn too much.

What would be some of the basics of trying to get a Red Fox? I'd really like to get one that is in my area and had pups last year. Any magic?
Thanks


 
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KeokukCoboy
 January 13 2018 08:49PM  
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Last evening about an hour or so before dark I went calling even though my luck is nill in windy conditions I sat up North of Sigourney just outside of the city limits. With the snow being crunchy and my steps loud, walking in to set up wasn't a quiet one. When the wind would quit blowing I would stop walking till it started blowing again trying to hide the noise. I sat up in a small timber, cornfield on one side CRP and evergreen trees on the other. The calling sequence was an interrogation howl 3min silence Interrogation howl another 3min of silence. Played a mad jack distress and by using the volume control I would alternate the sound from loud to soft. Waited 5min. Sometime right around here the wind was getting calm and I could hear something behind me. The way I was set up, there was no point in looking back there so I just sat still and off to my right I hear something else coming in. At this point I have no clue what animal is behind me but it had moved closer and stopped. I could see the one to my right moving along and its a coyote. Now I know the one behind me is also a coyote because they sounded the same when they walked. In about five seconds this dog to my right was going to get a big whiff of this human. He was about 25yds out. I turned my head just a little, the dog behind me bolts ,I raised my weapon on the second one by the time I would have got him in my scope he was gone. Still a fun hunt but looking back there were two things I did wrong. 1st I didn't position myself and was facing the wrong direction but where I was a I knew they can come from anywhere. My 2nd bad move was I should have taken my shotgun. Usually when setting up in thick timber, shots are close. Thought Id share this with you....Tomorrows another day.....


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Tally Ho
 January 14 2018 08:59AM  
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^KCoboy

When I read your post I see were your experience set in by not taking the shot.

I had a similar deal like that a couple of weeks ago I had my shotgun but the yote came in to my left at 25 yards where my boy was sitting beside me. I couldn't make a good shot and the coyote was on a ridge so was out of sight in a hurry. My boy was disappointed I did not try shoot anyway. I guess the point is I rather see coyote scurry off then shoot and have a slim and none chance with a educated coyote running away.. It was still fun and my boy was excited but he learned how fast things happed and how they use the wind.


 
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KeokukCoboy
 January 14 2018 07:11PM  
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I had a similar deal like that a couple of weeks ago I had my shotgun but the yote came in to my left at 25 yards where my boy was sitting beside me. I couldn't make a good shot and the coyote was on a ridge so was out of sight in a hurry. My boy was disappointed I did not try shoot anyway. I guess the point is I rather see coyote scurry off then shoot and have a slim and none chance with a educated coyote running away.. It was still fun and my boy was excited but he learned how fast things happed and how they use the wind.




Good to hear from you Tallyho, Hope your year has been a successful one. You bring out a very good point, one we don't talk about much and that is the shot. A missed coyote turns into an educated one real quick. Lord knows we all have a miss now and again but to shoot a low percentage shot with hopes of a lucky hit, just makes the game a little more difficult the next time. OP I hope Im not hijacking your thread but here's another issue that may come up, It happened to my brother this evening. He sat up in a timber with little underbrush when it was almost dark, he stood up to pack things in and spooked one coming to the call about 40 yds. In timber, sometimes they can be hard to see when they come in stealth mode. Scanning the area before getting up with binoculars can help. I actually had this happen to me calling by a picked cornfield No snow on the ground, walking real slow in front of me, I ended up getting eyeglasses after that one.


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Cactus Juice
 January 15 2018 04:20PM  
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Any and all info is welcome. I didn't make it out this weekend, it was just too cold for me. The forcast looks good so far for this coming weekend. I hope I can make it out.

I also am carrying both shotgun and rifle in always...just to be safe. I'm sure on the new ground, I will have closer shots because of the thicker timber.

Now, it's just a waiting game to see what the wind is going to do, and which way I can sneak in.


Brian
 
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KeokukCoboy
 January 16 2018 07:48AM  
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Cactus Juice

Good luck this weekend. Let us know how you do.


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Mengo
 January 17 2018 09:11AM  
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Good Luck to everyone going out. The weather change could make it interesting.


 
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whiterook
 January 17 2018 11:04AM  
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Latter part of December on. Most all young coyotes will be in transit. As they become nomadic. Some grouping up into loose packs. As they try to find their way, a potential mate & establish their own territory. Some of those loose groups may/will have a lone female among them. As the single males in that group. Seek her attention. Over my yrs. I've seen numerous nomadic groups. It is interesting to observe their behaviors among the group.

I seen 4 singles one day last wk. How refreshing.

It's been a few yrs now. An ex-coworker one early morning. Seen a group of 11 coyotes run by his property. When he happened to look out of the kitchen window. That was near Haverhill Iowa. Which use to hold a good pop of coyotes in the area.


 
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KeokukCoboy
 January 17 2018 04:42PM  
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Latter part of December on. Most all young coyotes will be in transit. As they become nomadic. Some grouping up into loose packs. As they try to find their way, a potential mate & establish their own territory. Some of those loose groups may/will have a lone female among them. As the single males in that group. Seek her attention. Over my yrs. I've seen numerous nomadic groups. It is interesting to observe their behaviors among the group.

I seen 4 singles one day last wk. How refreshing.

It's been a few yrs now. An ex-coworker one early morning. Seen a group of 11 coyotes run by his property. When he happened to look out of the kitchen window. That was near Haverhill Iowa. Which use to hold a good pop of coyotes in the area.



E.V. I have know way of proving this but what I am seeing ( or hearing rather) is in a certain area where Im calling, it seems that several packs are getting closer together. Still separate from each other but squeezing each other in their home turf. Hope Im making sense here. Hearing four different packs in the same area seems pretty tight. I should also mention that this was on a creek bottom on a crisp cold evening which also could make the sounds seem closer than they appear. The packs sound larger than normal from what Im used to hearing but its just in this one area. Any thoughts on this? Thanks..


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whiterook
 January 17 2018 08:32PM  
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Quote by: KeokukCoboy

Latter part of December on. Most all young coyotes will be in transit. As they become nomadic. Some grouping up into loose packs. As they try to find their way, a potential mate & establish their own territory. Some of those loose groups may/will have a lone female among them. As the single males in that group. Seek her attention. Over my yrs. I've seen numerous nomadic groups. It is interesting to observe their behaviors among the group.




E.V. I have know way of proving this but what I am seeing ( or hearing rather) is in a certain area where Im calling, it seems that several packs are getting closer together. Still separate from each other but squeezing each other in their home turf. Hope Im making sense here. Hearing four different packs in the same area seems pretty tight. I should also mention that this was on a creek bottom on a crisp cold evening which also could make the sounds seem closer than they appear. The packs sound larger than normal from what Im used to hearing but its just in this one area. Any thoughts on this? Thanks..



Who can say for a fact what is going on, as you state. I've expressed myself above. In that right now. There are many nomadic yearlings on the move. Some singular, some in groups.


 
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whiterook
 January 17 2018 08:47PM  
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Coyotes do trespass. I also believe most know they are trespassing on another's marked territory. It has been my observations. That trespassing coyotes are very alert & skittish. Not staying on another's territory for very long. I've witnessed that a few times on the open rolling crop hills I've hunted for decades.

Some yrs back I came in contact with a farmer who was having his sheep killed. We met & I told him I would do what I could for him. That pr of coyotes the male was very large I suspect in the high 40's. The female was joe average around 30 lbs or so. I hunted that 1x2 mile section hard all Winter. Seen them a few times on the move but not bedded down. One day they were bedded down. The male was on the 1/2 mile fence line drift. His female below him aways. I stalked in to the last hill before the 1/2 mile. I took aim in a high cross-wind & took a long shot on the male. Missed him. But the female bolted angling me. I dumped her with a neck shot. I wanted that male.

So day after day I hunted that section. Worth noting is. He would occasionally leave that section. But no other area coyote entered that 1x2 mile. Not one all that Winter, did another coyote enter that 1x2 mile section. I found that very interesting. Well my Farmer's sheep killing came to a stop, once the female coyote died. Yet the male was still in that section. I kept in touch with that farmer...Still no sheep killing.

Next winter rolls in. Again the farmer & I visit about that male coyote. He said, his neighbor guy now has a sheep killer on his property. Well I believe that killer male left his old territory & hooked with with a lone female. Et got her into killing sheep with him aways down the highway...

My above comments, bring up another thing worth mentioning. Like with Red Fox kits. It is the female that does all of the teaching for her young litter. I suspect same goes for coyotes. If/when a mother Red gets killed or dies while the kits are still dependent? The male then resumes her duty. I do not believe, coyotes are any different.


 
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KeokukCoboy
 January 18 2018 08:10AM  
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Who can say for a fact what is going on, as you state. I've expressed myself above. In that right now. There are many nomadic yearlings on the move. Some singular, some in groups.
whiterook
January 17 2018 08:47PM

Coyotes do trespass. I also believe most know they are trespassing on another's marked territory. It has been my observations. That trespassing coyotes are very alert & skittish. Not staying on another's territory for very long. I've witnessed that a few times on the open rolling crop hills I've hunted for decades.

Some yrs back I came in contact with a farmer who was having his sheep killed. We met & I told him I would do what I could for him. That pr of coyotes the male was very large I suspect in the high 40's. The female was joe average around 30 lbs or so. I hunted that 1x2 mile section hard all Winter. Seen them a few times on the move but not bedded down. One day they were bedded down. The male was on the 1/2 mile fence line drift. His female below him aways. I stalked in to the last hill before the 1/2 mile. I took aim in a high cross-wind & took a long shot on the male. Missed him. But the female bolted angling me. I dumped her with a neck shot. I wanted that male.

So day after day I hunted that section. Worth noting is. He would occasionally leave that section. But no other area coyote entered that 1x2 mile. Not one all that Winter, did another coyote enter that 1x2 mile section. I found that very interesting. Well my Farmer's sheep killing came to a stop, once the female coyote died. Yet the male was still in that section. I kept in touch with that farmer...Still no sheep killing.

Next winter rolls in. Again the farmer & I visit about that male coyote. He said, his neighbor guy now has a sheep killer on his property. Well I believe that killer male left his old territory & hooked with with a lone female. Et got her into killing sheep with him aways down the highway...

My above comments, bring up another thing worth mentioning. Like with Red Fox kits. It is the female that does all of the teaching for her young litter. I suspect same goes for coyotes. If/when a mother Red gets killed or dies while the kits are still dependent? The male then resumes her duty. I do not believe, coyotes are any different.




I always thought that when pups were dispersed earlier( like around November) and became nomads they would seek out a partner asap and from there find there own territory. Knowing what Im hearing in the field and reading this,I am highly incorrect. It makes sense for nomads to form a pack within them selves and from there they would pick a mate. If this is the case then I need to change strategies this time of year. Need to find my notebook,havent put anything down in it this year.


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